TFC player 2024 in-season roster discussion

[MikeForbes]

I'll further my Brooks agenda. Herdman has experience with Brooks similar to his experience with Flores. Infact, Brooks second last game with the USMNT was a 1-1 draw against Canada that he played the full 90 in September 2021.

Afterwards, it seems he fell out of favor with Berhalter and was never called up again.

If TFC can get him for around the million mark, that is a much bigger impact signing for the next 2-3 years than some English guy signed because he is from the Newcastle area. Also, a perfect guy for Gomis to learn from and play with.

[Prof]

No. Pos. Nation Player
1 GK United States USA Sean Johnson - Keep
5 DF Republic of Ireland IRL Kevin Long - Keep
6 DF Zambia ZAM Aimé Mabika - Release
7 FW Canada CAN Jahkeele Marshall-Rutty (HG) - Loan out
8 MF England ENG Matty Longstaff - Keep
10 FW Italy ITA Federico Bernardeschi (DP) _ keep
11 FW Haiti HAI Derrick Etienne Jr. - Keep
12 FW South Africa RSA Cassius Mailula - Loan out
14 MF Spain ESP Alonso Coello - Keep
15 DF France FRA Nicksoen Gomis - Keep
16 FW Trinidad and Tobago TRI Tyrese Spicer - Keep
17 DF Norway NOR Sigurd Rosted - Release
18 GK Trinidad and Tobago TRI Greg Ranjitsingh - Release
19 DF Canada CAN Kobe Franklin (HG) - Loan out
20 MF Honduras HON Deybi Flores - Keep
21 MF Canada CAN Jonathan Osorio (Captain) - Keep
22 MF Canada CAN Richie Laryea (DP) - Keep
23 MF United States USA Brandon Servania - Release
24 FW Italy ITA Lorenzo Insigne (DP) - Release
27 DF United States USA Shane O'Neill - Release
28 DF Italy ITA Raoul Petretta - Keep
29 FW Canada CAN Deandre Kerr (HG) - Loan out
47 MF Canada CAN Kosi Thompson - Loan out
51 DF Canada CAN Adam Pearlman (HG) - Loan out
90 GK Canada CAN Luka Gavran - Keep
99 FW Germany GER Prince Owusu - Keep

Of the 26 currently on the roster only 14 have shown that they deserve to play for TFC. Release or loan out the rest.

[Mr. Inbetween]

Yeah, but that happens regularly when teams go to the Premier League. He likely had chances to be loaned to a lower level but wanted to compete and prove he could make it. Given his years prior in the Championship, he clearly was good enough for that level.

Get that that happens. Just/more concerned about rust/performance decline. Hopefully there are training reports by scouting. EFL-Championship experience and quality is welcomed. IIUC, he is rehabbing/training in a program at Dubai with English coaches. Interesting is that he was USMNT eligible back in the day. So that may offset the requirement of an IS at TFC so long as he applies/has applied for or has a GC/PRC?

EDIT: He does not seem to meet their ‘Child born to a US Citizen father’ GC eligibility criteria.

[Mr. Inbetween]

Wouldn't that entice him to go?

Yes and no… If there was only one roster space/deal to be made at such a wage for that on-pitch and marketing role.

[leedsandTFC]

No. Pos. Nation Player
1 GK United States USA Sean Johnson - Keep
5 DF Republic of Ireland IRL Kevin Long - Keep
6 DF Zambia ZAM Aimé Mabika - Release
7 FW Canada CAN Jahkeele Marshall-Rutty (HG) - Loan out
8 MF England ENG Matty Longstaff - Keep
10 FW Italy ITA Federico Bernardeschi (DP) _ keep
11 FW Haiti HAI Derrick Etienne Jr. - Keep
12 FW South Africa RSA Cassius Mailula - Loan out
14 MF Spain ESP Alonso Coello - Keep
15 DF France FRA Nicksoen Gomis - Keep
16 FW Trinidad and Tobago TRI Tyrese Spicer - Keep
17 DF Norway NOR Sigurd Rosted - Release
18 GK Trinidad and Tobago TRI Greg Ranjitsingh - Release
19 DF Canada CAN Kobe Franklin (HG) - Loan out
20 MF Honduras HON Deybi Flores - Keep
21 MF Canada CAN Jonathan Osorio (Captain) - Keep
22 MF Canada CAN Richie Laryea (DP) - Keep
23 MF United States USA Brandon Servania - Release
24 FW Italy ITA Lorenzo Insigne (DP) - Release
27 DF United States USA Shane O'Neill - Release
28 DF Italy ITA Raoul Petretta - Keep
29 FW Canada CAN Deandre Kerr (HG) - Loan out
47 MF Canada CAN Kosi Thompson - Loan out
51 DF Canada CAN Adam Pearlman (HG) - Loan out
90 GK Canada CAN Luka Gavran - Keep
99 FW Germany GER Prince Owusu - Keep

Of the 26 currently on the roster only 14 have shown that they deserve to play for TFC. Release or loan out the rest.

petretta needs to unless he takes a big pay cut.

900k/ year, production is of a 3-450K player.

even then, doesn't seem a winning player.

[Mr. Inbetween]

^
Agree. Renegotiate contract. Add a year to two at half his current wage. Otherwise…

[OgtheDim]

We are not getting rid of half the roster during the season.

By the beginning of next season - maybe...

But a lot of the contracts people want to release are guaranteed through 2025

[leedsandTFC]

We are not getting rid of half the roster during the season.

By the beginning of next season - maybe...

But a lot of the contracts people want to release are guaranteed through 2025

I think people are talking about over next few windows.

[Mr. Inbetween]

We are not getting rid of half the roster during the season. By the beginning of next season - maybe... But a lot of the contracts people want to release are guaranteed through 2025

IMO, only 4 really… Mailula, Mbongne, Petretta and Rosted. IIRC, about half of Etiene’s salary next season is still being paid by Huston; up to USD375K could be by TFC. Some rumours/signs Mailula is already gone. Mbongne should be able to be loaned/transferred. Petretta and Rosted could be squeezed so long as neither have a ‘no trade clause’. The option of being traded within MLS a la Etienne may motivate both or one of them to renegotiate each of their contract terms to a more reasonable and favourable amount.

[los sonadores]

petretta needs to unless he takes a big pay cut.

900k/ year, production is of a 3-450K player.

even then, doesn't seem a winning player.

Certainly on too high wages for MLS. (Bob aside, that probably has to do with the fairly large money he was on in Turkey the season before he signed here).

As for not being a winning player, he won the Swiss Super League and was runner up four times with Basel. He won the Swiss Cup. Played very well and won matches in the Champions and Europa leagues. A good player if used well.

[Mr. Inbetween]

^
IIUC, he was making about USD375K at both Kasimpasa and Basel.

[Amir.]

you cant just tell someone take a paycut or leave with nothing when they have a guaranteed contract...the ball is in their court...under mls rules what you can do is trade him and even then you might pay some of his salary(like etienne)...with a buyout hes getting paid all of it and then theres the mutual termination where the player either has something else lined up with similar money or he has a smaller deal lined up and youre also offering a big chunk of what you owe him under his current contract(like akinola)

lets stop the fantasy world stuff where petretta takes a 500k paycut

[Mr. Inbetween]

Not fantasy at all. If considered in the context of a previous comment made where a contract is renegotiated by adding a year or two. A common mechanism.

[Amir.]

sure..."hey raoul instead of making 900k in 2025 come play for us in 2025 2026 2027 for 1.2M so we're gonna give you a whole 300k more to stay here two more years...what do you say raoul? raoul...raoul are you still on the line??"

[los sonadores]

^
IIUC, he was making about USD375K at both Kasimpasa and Basel.

I wonder about that… what’s your source? Not sure that Turkey is entirely transparent about wages to foreign players… and then there is the tax situation, etc. It surprises me that Petretta turned down Basil’s contract extension offer to go to Turkey to be on the same wages and not play in the UEFA leagues.

Now you well may know this better than I do: was he under contract at Kasimpasa when we went for him? I know he wanted to leave. Maybe related: At the time I saw reports out of Denmark that Bronby was paid a 3-4 million DKK transfer fee for Rosted… $6-700,000 CND. I assume that is inflating what we are annually paying him. I would not be surprised if it was about the same for Petretta. I’m pretty sure he was under contract. MLS is a.weird league to conflate transfer payments with wages.

[los sonadores]

Not fantasy at all. If considered in the context of a previous comment made where a contract is renegotiated by adding a year or two. A common mechanism.

I think he’s on 650,000 currently or I am wrong? What makes most sense to me is that we played a transfer fee like we did with Rostad. If fact, it looks like it. If his wages are 650,000 and his cap hit is 900,000 then the difference must be the transfer fee, now the second year payment.

Still wondering about the $650,000 though… how it came to be so? (And please hold the Bob jokes even if I know they are justified.)

[leedsandTFC]

Pretty obvious I'm talking about keeping past 2025.

[GMoneyTalks]

Petretta's next contract will definitely be for less if he decides to stay here. Whatever the going rate is for a guy who can play multiple positions but shouldn't be a consistent starter at any. A solid rotational depth guy.

Now, you can negotiate that with him. I'm not sure if that positively affects his cap hit for 2025.

E.g. let's say he knows his value is $400k on his next deal & wants to stay. Extend him to 2027 + team option at 2025 + 800k. You should be able to at least bring his annual value down for next year to help with cap space. But then that makes you worse off in 2026 & 2027.

I personally think he plays next year at his normal salary (unless Jason can deal him) & then they reassess based on needs on whether they bring him back.

[OgtheDim]

Pretty obvious I'm talking about keeping past 2025.

It was the statement by Prof at the end of his list - not you.

But, as others have said, likely was talking about windows.


I just see so much social media stuff about "get rid of them NOW" that is clearly based on Football Manager.

[leedsandTFC]

It was the statement by Prof at the end of his list - not you.

But, as others have said, likely was talking about windows.


I just see so much social media stuff about "get rid of them NOW" that is clearly based on Football Manager.

yeah kinda silly.

although guys like rosted and petrett going into last years of their deals next year are definitely easier to shift.

let go for free and eat a portion of year 1 salary at their new cllubs.

[Mr. Inbetween]

sure..."hey raoul instead of making 900k in 2025 come play for us in 2025 2026 2027 for 1.2M so we're gonna give you a whole 300k more to stay here two more years...what do you say raoul? raoul...raoul are you still on the line??"

It’s a negotiation. TFC will know through his agent where he stands and he will understand TFC’s position and intentions. If TFC do not want to buy him out they may consider and explore the possibility of an Etienne within MLS; by covering half his salary while another club pays the other half TFC creates almost half a million in cap space. The consensus seems to be he is not worth his current salary. That assement may apply for/to another league as well.

[Mr. Inbetween]

I wonder about that… what’s your source? Not sure that Turkey is entirely transparent about wages to foreign players… and then there is the tax situation, etc. It surprises me that Petretta turned down Basil’s contract extension offer to go to Turkey to be on the same wages and not play in the UEFA leagues. Now you well may know this better than I do: was he under contract at Kasimpasa when we went for him? I know he wanted to leave. Maybe related: At the time I saw reports out of Denmark that Bronby was paid a 3-4 million DKK transfer fee for Rosted… $6-700,000 CND. I assume that is inflating what we are annually paying him. I would not be surprised if it was about the same for Petretta. I’m pretty sure he was under contract. MLS is a.weird league to conflate transfer payments with wages.

I think he’s on 650,000 currently or I am wrong? What makes most sense to me is that we played a transfer fee like we did with Rostad. If fact, it looks like it. If his wages are 650,000 and his cap hit is 900,000 then the difference must be the transfer fee, now the second year payment. Still wondering about the $650,000 though… how it came to be so? (And please hold the Bob jokes even if I know they are justified.)

Fair and correct. The internet is my source; of course. Believe a transfer fee may have been paid on both Petretta moves. Agree, it is easy to mix up or in transfer fees and wages when reporting such numbers. I try my best not to; am not perfect. IIUC, the MLSPA Salary General Compensation number is the players MLS wage. Yet, perhaps not the ‘budget charge’, particularly against the Senior Roster, since it does not include any amortized transfer fees. IIRC, Petretta’s GC is at USD908+K. This would also explain why Laryea is at about GC USD1.2M yet he can be considered a DP/+1.6M with his transfer fee included in the ‘budget charge’.

[MikeForbes]

I'd rather let Petretta's contract just expire than have to watch him play another two seasons, even on a reduced salary. He is the epitome of just being a guy on the field.

[leedsandTFC]

I'd rather let Petretta's contract just expire than have to watch him play another two seasons, even on a reduced salary. He is the epitome of just being a guy on the field.

Some would say he's versatile.

I say he's too slow to play wingback, and too small to play cb.

I wonder if he'd have value in the league if we traded him but still picked like half his salary next year (like atlanta did with ettienne).

Hernandez did say some guys have value based on this season

[jloome]

Some would say he's versatile.

I say he's too slow to play wingback, and too small to play cb.

I'd say that's why he used him as a defensive midfielder the last two games. He has a better football brain than the young guys but he doesn't have the physical traits in this league for the two positions he's played up until now.

Either way, way too fucking expensive for this league.

[jloome]

If they play like they did yesterday regularly, JMR and Thompson might prove themselves yet. Jakheel was particularly good. Grew some testes last night and ran at players. He's terrifyingly quick sometimes and why he wasn't using it to run at guys much yet must've been a confidence issue.

[Amir.]

rutty can be a good rotation player in mls...still made one big giveaway in each half that couldve turned into goals...thompson is not mls level he cant make a single good pass when hes under pressure...and when they sent him to rb philly went at him and almost scored then the staff said hell no and sent him to midfield and played bernardeschi at rb...he cant defend and he cant play the ball cleanly under pressure

[leedsandTFC]

If they play like they did yesterday regularly, JMR and Thompson might prove themselves yet. Jakheel was particularly good. Grew some testes last night and ran at players. He's terrifyingly quick sometimes and why he wasn't using it to run at guys much yet must've been a confidence issue.

kosi has a ton of good attributes but badly needs to work on his decision making.

can't help but think a loan away mighe be beneficial.

JMR looked very good, bar 2 giveaways.

great header back across for the goal, and skinned his man multiple times.

[JoesphNdo]

JMR is such an interesting player in that you can absolutely see why he got the hype he got. His football instinct is next level, beyond any non Italian we have on the roster. Flash the ball at him with no space and no time to think and he'll effortlessly escape, his decision making there is amazing

But he's also so much worse when he has time to think. He slows down, and isn't able to get on the ball and influence the game. So you can also see why he's still here and why he may not even make it here.

A player like that with the right coaching really could go far. Hopefully Herdman is that coach because it's obvious he's not gotten great coaching here. The potential is absolutely clear to me, even if the impact hasnt been there yet. But his performance yesterday was a great sign.

[jloome]

he cant make a single good pass when hes under pressure...

He made two in the first half yesterday. I get it, you hate the guy's game.

Yesterday was probably his best performance for us. He sprung the forwards several times by beating their midfield with good last-second passes.

No, he's not ready for MLS. But he has potential, he showed it last night.

And any player is going to struggle switching to a role at the last second that they haven't really played in two years.