We are cannon fodder for apple’s test project. MLS was best when they actually put the supporter near the centre of what the league did. They’ve since moved on.Originally Posted by ensco
And while I think it’s good to see the league attempt to grow a wider audience, short term decision making is shaving the edge off the quality of the product and it’s highly annoying.
Yes but it's in Atlanta and the Canada vs Chile won't impact them at all because nobody there will care so ticket sales and attendance will be fine. As for people who want to watch TFC, Apple has on demand viewing so that's also sorted.
As you said the Atlanta vs Toronto match isn't the Superbowl or even a Copa Match so it really doesn't matter whether it's watched live or watched on delay by 30 minutes or so. I don't see the big deal here.
I don't believe that era ever existed in MLS tbh, and hasn't existed in large football leagues since around 1992, depending on which country you're looking at outside maybe of Germany and it took fans marching on the streets for that.
TV has dictated schedule since I've followed this league and it likely goes a long way back from that. And, as said, dictated the big European schedules since the 90s again with one possible exception & ironically, one of the things people complain the most about - uniform kick off times - is exactly what TV took away from the European leagues in what was considered one of the first signs of football being stripped away from the working class supporters
As Ultra & Proud said, I'll just watch this on delay. I don't see the big deal, it'd be a problem if we were at home - but home games clashing with huge other events isn't new, either. Didn't we clash with the bat flip game, and some Raptors game in 2019 that was a huge one on their march? The bigger problem is having games during these tournaments at all.
Last edited by JoesphNdo; 06-28-2024 at 12:24 PM.
I agree with you ensco that this game should have been done at a different time to boost Copa interest.
Long term thinking here is maximizing CanMNT 2026 interest is in the best interest of MLS.
But a lot of the MLS people are steeped in quarterly report thinking - affecting 2027 is not in their minds.
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I find the current BMO attending group so different from expectations because it seems divorced from the quality on the pitch while being knowledgeable about the game as a whole.
It ain't the same crowd as 2007 or 2017.
It reminds me most of the Jays crowds.
In Toronto sports right now, you don't attend for the results, you attend for the sport.
It's quite a thing to adjust to if you are results needing.
Last edited by OgtheDim; 06-28-2024 at 12:39 PM.
Yeah, appreciate the TV schedule has always dictated things somewhat.
But my comment about being authentic and supporter driven is really about that era where: the league got out of sub-optimal stadiums and into SSS, ditched hokey team names and bad branding, started aligning rules with FIFA, etc…
In my opinion they’ve progressively lost their marbles and started watering down their principals. Atlanta should have come into the league with a requirement to get onto a grass surface or SSS within 3 years. NER should be told the same or Kraft loses ownership. NYCFC should never have been allowed in if their plan was to play at Yankee stadium. This crap with the “slow substitutions” and “injuries” requiring teams to play a man down. Bullshit, drawn out mid season cup with the Mexican league. Touring around Messi to plunge people of dollars. Not figuring out their officiating. Making salaries top heavy where teams are not deep enough to play all these fixtures. Disregarding the FIFA calendar in major chunks of the year. It feels more like a series of side shows amd gimmicks rather than a real league.
They are making a number of short term, shit decisions because they are clinging to broader principals that frankly do not work here. I fear they’ve brought in too many old, white owners whose “American” sense of business is just keeping us from reaching our true potential. They just always default to trying to change something they don’t culturally understand rather than embarrassing the thing for what it is.
But what's new here?
The league launched with hockey style penalties. In 2007 they invented new rules and turned the whole thing into a circus for the celebrity of Beckham. Their officiating, stadiums, pitches have always been crap - but they've tried to improve officiating with VAR, which the rest of the world followed on, and made huge strides stadium and pitch wise. The fixtures have never respected the FIFA calendar. Which part of this is new? I'd argue we're less like the above than ever, though have far more of it than I'd like for sure.
And to be clear, TV didn't dictate fixture times 'somewhat', they dictated them period. TFC had a bit of a grey area there given TV and the team are bordering on a single entity, but that was happenstance. Nobody at MLS HQ ever said 'what would the match going fans want' before they said 'what would the TV companies want', or at least they haven't since I've been following the league. And that's true, like I said, more or less everywhere. I definitely have never experienced an era where MLS put the fans concerns first and TV/revenue interests second, and I've been there 12 years at this point.
To be clear, I'm not arguing that the stuff you dislike is good. Just it isn't new, at all. And mostly, not even unique to MLS. In my dream world the TV money in football is a tiny % of what it is now, games in Europe go back to their uniform, match going fan suiting kick off time, the football talent is evenly dispersed around the regions that can draw stadium supporters and football is for the working class match going fan. Football should be a sport built for the live fan experience, with everything else secondary. But that ship sailed so long ago we can't even see it from where we are.
Last edited by JoesphNdo; 06-28-2024 at 01:10 PM.
I don't think it's Copa interest that goes down, it's TFC viewership that will suffer. This TFC match is an afterthought at best to me now and I don't miss any of them.
Plus if it looks like we're doing another 2023 magical run of losing a string of 3-0 matches in a row then I won't even bother tuning in and opt for UFC.
Don’t think we’ll reach a consensus but appreciate your opinion, cheers.
Yeah, we have had versions of this argument a couple of times. No point in arguing. But if not actually “meaningful” (I get that argument- yes, you can tape it, I mostly do that for all games nowadays)… it is hugely symbolic. You are telling your fan base that you aren’t even trying, when you do this.
There just has to be more of an ability to opt out of the “Saturday 730pm or die” thing, on a reasonable basis. I mean, MLS clubs care enough about the interaction of CMNT success and their own to have paid Marsch's salary and put their brand on it.
"There are some people who might have better technique than me, and some may be fitter than me, but the main thing is tactics. With most players, tactics are missing. You can divide tactics into insight, trust, and daring." - Johan Cruyff
Oh yeah I don't think the core of what you're saying is wrong - again, playing at all during the Euros and Copa is insane, and I wish match going fans were the number 1 driver of gametimes. Just...we used to miss parts of the game if Curling ran over. I just want us to level set with the reality of how things were. It was always 'we aren't trying, and TV will dictate everything, hope that works out for you'
Either way, I hope Saturday is a big one. As a non Canadian, it surprises me that - anecdotally for me - there seems to be more interest in the Euros than the Copa in the city. Saturdays game is huge, I'd love to see Canada sneak it
^oh yeah. That was one of Canada's 5 biggest victories in the last 75 years. But you could start interviewing people on Yonge St, and if you asked 100 of them: “How do you feel about the victory over Peru”? 98 would not know what you are talking about.
"There are some people who might have better technique than me, and some may be fitter than me, but the main thing is tactics. With most players, tactics are missing. You can divide tactics into insight, trust, and daring." - Johan Cruyff
the wording for longstaff was actually doubtful so its hard to see him starting...didnt sound like petretta was 100% in either
gavran
rosted long gomis
bernardeschi flores thompson petretta
etienne owusu insigne
if petretta is out you could either bring mabika in at cb and push up gomis to wing back or bring rutty or franklin at wing back or start etienne at wing back and start someone like kerr in the front three
Atlanta is reportedly talking to Chelsea about them signing LB Caleb Wiley. Maybe that'll be a bit of a distraction tonight.
rosted to the bench to start petretta at cb and rutty at wing back...longstaff makes it
Probably strongest lineup we can field. Still very little expectations.
Osorio and Laryea are starting for Canada tonight too.
I'm really digging the Nats' lineup for tonight. I suspect it's because Marsch is going to play a defensive counter, so we're going for speed to burn with Shaff and Laryea starting.
etienne and rutty at wingback and bernardeschi in the front three with insigne and owusu
After careful consideration (two glasses of vodka and orange juice), gonna give TFC twenty minutes of my time. That Canada/Chile game is just too big and important to miss.
atlanta easily getting through our right side in the first five min
Yeh, that looks offside
25' rutty to insigne 0-1!
goal called back...0-0
Yeh, that moves been coming - they have been able to get through Flores & Longstaff & then Gomes bit....
almada scores at 45+2'...1-0
Gomes RCB paired with JMR as the RB - this is not working.
yup exactly that combo is not working
Atlanta is not all that good, to be honest - but our midfield is getting bypassed a lot causing a lot of pressure on our back 3 - it was unsustainable. That having been said, Atlanta is a gaff away from letting us tie this game.
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