Post Game: Chic 2 @ TFC 2

[rocker]

W- L- D after 11 games

2007---4-6-1---13pts--7 home games

2008---5-4-2---17pts--6 home games

2009---4-3-4---16pts--7 home games

2010---5-4-2---17pts--5 home games

interesting stats....none of those teams kept up that point-per-game pace.
So generally they started strong and fell down after that.

[torontocelt]

I think Winter has dealt well with what he inherited and until there is a replacement that will fit the criteria that he is looking for, including salary cap, his hands are tied. Winter didn't pick Peterson or Gargan so he is stuck with dealing with their contracts and finding replacements. Winter had a lot of positions to fill in a short period of time....can't blame him for crap left over from last year. He has to play somebody and the rookies just don't have the experience to step in.

Isn't the Ajax system all about giving youth a chance? Like I said I would rather experiment with youth than have these two in the side, what exactly do we have to lose, our results already are not good enough.

[kaos197O]

My biggest problem is that it does not take a genius to work out who is really crap in our team, for starters we have Peterson and Gargan. Why does Winter persist with these two? For me I would be willing to give anyone a chance over these two even if it were youth players. What exactly does he see in these two, I cannot see what he can see that is for sure? Before anyone says it, yep I think Peterson is beyond sh!t, nothing personal but the boy is pure crap for $140,000 a season, it really pisses me off.

They must practice hard and give it their ALL.

Good night out with the boys but DAMN, what happened to the atmosphere at home? Chicago had more flags and were givin er for tue full 90. Much of BMO was a mOrgue. BOO! Anyhow, not much to say really, other than wE are not good enough.

BTW, Halifax Donair in Milton(Burlington too) really brings it, down home style. I highly recommend to all East Coasters looking for a good donair fix. Mmmmmmmmm, delicious.

[Sweeper]

That's what we're counting on. So, will there be new players or will these guys get better? Because one thing we can count on is the opposition will be better late in the season.

Agree, MLS definitely gets better as the season goes on. I think a couple of decent signings are imminent. I like the patience of this management team in their search for the right players.

[Juanito]

It will be interesting to see how the fans are react in a few months if results continue like this that is for sure. No matter what anyone says here, football is a results driven business. Players, managers and owners live by the sword and die by the sword. If people in Toronto dont think that then they have been well and truly brain washed by MLSE, Leafs fans are already proof of that.

Personally, I'm ready to give Winter et. al. a pass for the year, as long as we are entertaining.

However, I know that people's patience with this club is very thin and they are ready to burn someone at the stake.

Still .... this LOSS (because at home, that is what a draw is) is hard to swallow.

[Sweeper]

Isn't the Ajax system all about giving youth a chance? Like I said I would rather experiment with youth than have these two in the side, what exactly do we have to lose, our results already are not good enough.

I think Plata was a decent experiment and at this point I don't think we have that much youth depth or Winter would be taking advantage of it.

[Auzzy]

There is no way Gargan would've started today had Borman not been away for personal reasons and Yourassawsky injured.

Who else could we star though minus Borman and Yourass? Would you try Morgan? Attakora?

I think Omphroy deserves a chance, he can't be any worse than Gargan.

Very good points. Some other posters don't seem to have the info from JMo's article: http://www.cbc.ca/sports/soccer/stor...-fire-tfc.html

i.e., Yourassowsky injury & Borman absence. However, I agree -- don't know why Omphroy or someone else doesn't get a chance above Gargan.

Something that I thought was great early in the game: Toronto was pressuring all over the field, usually first to the ball, giving Chicago little time to control the ball, leading to lots of turnovers in Toronto's favour, and protecting Toronto's backline from too much pressure. You know, the kind of play that everyone else has been employing vs. Toronto this season.

Towards the end, that all went to shit. Toronto was 2nd to every ball, no control, little pressure...

[Juanito]

You tell them Frei:

http://torontofc.neulion.com/tfc/con...atid=2&id=3122

[jazzy]

just feel our first touch and pass, again, lets us down, after some hard work defensively, we give the ball away , clearly too often , usually at midfield. And as much as I admire Stevanovich's drive and skillset, pass the fookin ball, when he sees 2/3 opposing players, he's like bull seeing red, and has to take them on...usually giving up the ball...same for Tchaini, who is a hard worker, his passes to nowhere are hurting us

[Walnut]

2007
(Mo Johnston)
3-6-1 (10pts)


2008
(Johnston/Carver)
5-3-2 (17 pts)

2009
(Carver/Cummins)
3-3-4 (13 pts)

2010
(Preki)
5-4-1 (16pts)

2011
(Winter-Mariner)
2-3-5 (11pts)

And the wheels have yet to fall off during the Gold Cup - we still have that to look forward to.

[jazzy]

We have second division defenders, that's why. Not holding the ball well in the attack doesn't help either. Last year the whole team defended so there wasn't as much pressure on the crappy defenders. I think there is only so much you can do in one season.

just read it , harsh on the defenders, mls capable, but well put

[Jeffro]

Cue Pookie and v00d00 defending the brilliant coach that's getting us draws at home and losses on the road.

Again, we'll be lucky to win 5.

Cue Regina, trolling the board as usual.

If that first quote isn't an infraction, calling out and baiting members like that, I don't know what is.

[torontocelt]

I think Plata was a decent experiment and at this point I don't think we have that much youth depth or Winter would be taking advantage of it.

Agreed, Plata has been great. He is a decent player and works really hard, that is what all our players should be doing. If you are a limited player you can make up for it with hard work, if you are a decent player and dont work hard then you are a liability. All of our team should be working their socks off like Plata, they should chase after every winnable ball and pressure the opposition whilst keeping shape. If they done that they would go a long way with making up for their short comings.

[Juanito]

Jeffro ....



HA HA HA! I say this in pure jest folks! Come on guys, let's move on ... TFCRegina has his opinion, no need to start a dumpfest ... damn this squad makes for very unhappy supporters .... start winning DAMMIT!!

[lobo]

guess it's just talent. Gargan isn't capable. Cann does some things very well and some things very poorly. Cann can head and clear a ball, but sometimes whiffs when players are in close (like today) and isn't a good passer.. get a speedy player near him and he's often beat (unless he scrambles and makes some awkward tackle). Dicoy Williams is alright but seems stretched to play 90 minutes (I think he's better than Nana at passing and almost as good physically as Nana). Eckersley is the only one I would say is a solid MLS defender.

i'm not talking about clearing the ball or passing it out ... i'm talking about simple defending tactics ... gargan jockeys bone inside the box, slows him down, but nobody gets behind to provide cover support (deguz and peterson both nearby), gargan gets beat cause he jumps in like a schoolboy (duh), and bone puts a ball across the goal, then eckersly and dicoy both play the ball (neither gets it) while Barouch is left alone to attack the far post, goal ... cann held a good position marking chaves, peterson doing dick all, only soolsma rushing in from the wing to mark Barouch (too late, but he shouldn't have to do that if our defenders were doing their job) ... simple defending by a U18 girls team would have prevented that goal ... get behind the ball, cover the defender pressuring the ball, balanced goalside marking, stay with your man ... this is simple stuff, no need for a lot of passing talent (that helps the counter attack) ... too much ball watching in front of our goal, and not enough basic simple defending, it's just fackin ugly to watch

[Juanito]

I agree with lobo ... this team lacks some basic defensive skills. They get way too cute in the box for my comfort and it tends to bite them in the arse.

[Jeffro]

Jeffro ....



HA HA HA! Come on guys, let's move on ... TFCRegina has his opinion, no need to start a dumpfest ... damn this squad makes for very unhappy supporters .... start winning DAMMIT!!

So state an opinion, don't try to start shit with your fellow supporters.

[Derko]

Fuck Gargan all attacks were on his wing, goal was his and the rest of the d's fault

^Which goal???

First Chicago goal was a free kick off of a shit call by the referee, Frei had no chance, after that TFC started playing behind the ball, no attack, result was Chicago pressed for another goal, which Frei got a hand to it but a slidin Chicago player directed it in, It wasn't even on Gargan's side of the pitch!!! One of the finest 60 minutes TFC have ever played, creative and using the whole field. I'll take the draw for actually seeing good football for an hour. My opinion, that's all

[lobo]

I agree with lobo ... this team lacks some basic defensive skills. They get way too cute in the box for my comfort and it tends to bite them in the arse.

thanks juan ... and i agree with those calling for some our youth defenders to get some minutes in

[Derko]

No energy in second half, man I miss DeRO

Agree on the no energy, but hey man Dero is gone

[Shakes McQueen]

Personally, I'm ready to give Winter et. al. a pass for the year, as long as we are entertaining.

However, I know that people's patience with this club is very thin and they are ready to burn someone at the stake.

Still .... this LOSS (because at home, that is what a draw is) is hard to swallow.

As long as I see tangible development in the roster, and the way we play, over the course of the season - I'm okay with the team not garnering great results this season. It doesn't make you feel any better after a game like tonight, but after a few days, that sense of perspective seeps back in for me.

This has been my stance since before the season started. I'm okay with taking the season to lay a strong foundation, as long as it's clear that foundation is being laid. That's impossible to gauge from mere results - especially a small and relatively early sample of games - because the reality is a lot of these guys will be gone over the course of this season and the winter.

Other people are less patient, or don't think such time is necessary, and I understand those points of view. Where I get angry, is when these views are belittled as apologist, or being a "sheep" for MLSE, or whatever.

- Scott

[Shakes McQueen]

So state an opinion, don't try to start shit with your fellow supporters.

Yeah, articulating an opinion isn't the same as taking unprovoked potshots at fellow supporters.

- Scott

[Derko]

Wrong. The turning point was Peterson's foul at the top of the box that led to their goal from the resulting free kick. It was all one way traffic toward the Fire's end before that play. Mental lapse #107 so far this season by TFC's players

Was it really a foul, didn't look like one from 110. looked like Peterson just stole the ball and the man went to ground.

[Derko]

thanks juan ... and i agree with those calling for some our youth defenders to get some minutes in

I have been unhappy with Cann's getting cute with the ball so far this year, he really can be a shitty defender, someone said Nana's distribution was poor, Cann's is horrible to say the least, yet he gets every start.wtf

[leafsman]

That second goal was gargan fault, he was the one that got beat to let the guy send the ball across. he was brutal as usual

[Heathen]

Best halftime show ever

"We all dream of a team of Joao Platas!"

[lobo]

^Which goal???

First Chicago goal was a free kick off of a shit call by the referee, Frei had no chance, after that TFC started playing behind the ball, no attack, result was Chicago pressed for another goal, which Frei got a hand to it but a slidin Chicago player directed it in, It wasn't even on Gargan's side of the pitch!!! One of the finest 60 minutes TFC have ever played, creative and using the whole field. I'll take the draw for actually seeing good football for an hour. My opinion, that's all

fire's second goal started with a direct attack on gargan, and gargan lost badly ... so, yes the goal did not happen on gargan's side, but the attack leading to the goal did... can't blame the goal entirely on gargan though, because nobody covered his stupid move, and barouch was left unmarked at far post

some piss poor defending washed out all that creativity you admired

(btw, nice much-needed win by the tangerines today)

[jazzy]

Was it really a foul, didn't look like one from 110. looked like Peterson just stole the ball and the man went to ground.

yes thats what I saw, and in a sense another game decided by the ref.....that was good defending, he got btwn his player and had the ball, then on cue other player drops and ref calls foul ,........just don;t get it Plata gets kicked all night long and nothing and simple dives bam, foul

[Derko]

i'm not talking about clearing the ball or passing it out ... i'm talking about simple defending tactics ... gargan jockeys bone inside the box, slows him down, but nobody gets behind to provide cover support (deguz and peterson both nearby), gargan gets beat cause he jumps in like a schoolboy (duh), and bone puts a ball across the goal, then eckersly and dicoy both play the ball (neither gets it) while Barouch is left alone to attack the far post, goal ... cann held a good position marking chaves, peterson doing dick all, only soolsma rushing in from the wing to mark Barouch (too late, but he shouldn't have to do that if our defenders were doing their job) ... simple defending by a U18 girls team would have prevented that goal ... get behind the ball, cover the defender pressuring the ball, balanced goalside marking, stay with your man ... this is simple stuff, no need for a lot of passing talent (that helps the counter attack) ... too much ball watching in front of our goal, and not enough basic simple defending, it's just fackin ugly to watch

I actually agree on some of your comments about defending, they need to be addressed.

I hope it is enough for Blackpool, but I don't think so, TFC=Blakpool of Canada!!

[kaos197O]

As long as I see tangible development in the roster, and the way we play, over the course of the season - I'm okay with the team not garnering great results this season. It doesn't make you feel any better after a game like tonight, but after a few days, that sense of perspective seeps back in for me.

This has been my stance since before the season started. I'm okay with taking the season to lay a strong foundation, as long as it's clear that foundation is being laid. That's impossible to gauge from mere results - especially a small and relatively early sample of games - because the reality is a lot of these guys will be gone over the course of this season and the winter.

Other people are less patient, or don't think such time is necessary, and I understand those points of view. Where I get angry, is when these views are belittled as apologist, or being a "sheep" for MLSE, or whatever.

- Scott

Not that it means much but after watching the TFC Academy U17's today, it looks as if defense may be an ongoing issue! I was surprised at how small the midfield was(yet seemingly strong) and how nicely the team passed as a whole, but the finishing, and more so the defending, was pretty lousy today. Granted, the team is brand new, as many from last year are gone but......

I think we have to hope for improvements all the way around TBH!